so i am a new player playing with some friends who played about 5 years ago. we thought it would be cool to come play with them after hearing their stories and talk about lore. little did we know that new players seem unwelcome to grow. we are told that its to encourage new players to team up and fight against the big teams with God tier level gear and massive pvp experience. 1 experienced pvp player can easily take down 6-10 new players without any issues and if that wasn't bad enough they take it a step farther and gain up on the new players with years of long bonds. making matches of 14 vs 4. they than taunt the players and say oh don't worry the forces have retreated you can easily win now so when new players think OK they are being nice they come back...nope they are just farming stats for their swords and trying to get more heads for their walls. this makes the new players think they have two choices. they can either join a massive town if they are allowed in were they have to undergo trials to prove they are worthy of trust just for a small chance they they can build in a cool town and leave a mark assuming the town has any room for them to build. most of these big towns are bored because they have nothing left that needs built. or choice two they can just leave Loka and either play another game completely or start on a more friendly server. while the concept of loka is really cool and it has a lot of lore the veteran players make it no fun to play as the new player because they keep gaining up on them
Welcome to our Forums!
Type /register while in-game to register for a forum account.
New players being smashed discourages playing Loka
- Thread starter finniar
- Start date
I have to agree. Players come and go, but they mostly go, cause of this reason. Conquest being one sided, and all dependant on how quickly a good player can CRIT on a new player.
If conquest could be a VoTA skill game, where you use many buffs and traps, and have a team limit on both sides, so players wouldnt be wrecked to pulp, it would be lot more fun. Atleast i think so.
If conquest could be a VoTA skill game, where you use many buffs and traps, and have a team limit on both sides, so players wouldnt be wrecked to pulp, it would be lot more fun. Atleast i think so.
At first while reading this I was pretty sure nothing could be done about this, as it's kind of a mindset that some people have on Loka, not a flawed gameplay mechanic. But after a bit of thinking, I do think something can be done ahout this. Perhaps an optional truce period could be established for new Towns? Quite honestly I don't know if this is already a feature - if it is, I know it wasn't very long truce period.
This is a pretty tricky situation. Thinking about it I have a couple of ways to try and fix this.
One, you could limit the team size of conquest fights to both sides. The limit would be set by the defending side since in this case they'd be at the disadvantage of the huge town. Four people in a small town defending means only four from the big town can attack.
Two, balance the teams during a fight. If a town that is defending has less strength than the town that is attacking, (In this case way less) the defending town could receive some great buffs depending on how much the strength difference is. This way since the town is barely starting and that this huge town wants their territory plus to grind them, while defending they could receive some much needed help. Like a ton more health for their TG, higher damage Golems, more Golems, or even a wither to aid them! This could help balance the fight as it'd feel more fair to the small town but also force huge towns to work harder for that last territory they need to become World Capital.
Three, this one is a bit crazy and probably too ambitious but I'll share it anyway. Maybe make a brand new continent meant for just new towns? This continent, if they choose to, means that they can live there and learn the ropes. Without the pressure of huge towns breathing down their necks. Plus this gives them the opportunity to attack other beginning towns and learn how the conquest fights work along with how to improve. To keep new towns always fresh on this continent you'd have only a month or two to learn on this continent before you need to stake your claim on the main three and choose to make an alliance or not.
These are a couple of ideas I came up with to maybe solve the problem. Yet I don't know how the development process works so this might not be possible. Either way, I hope that these options could get some more brainstorming going in others so we can find a good solution to keep new players and make them feel prepared for the server!
One, you could limit the team size of conquest fights to both sides. The limit would be set by the defending side since in this case they'd be at the disadvantage of the huge town. Four people in a small town defending means only four from the big town can attack.
Two, balance the teams during a fight. If a town that is defending has less strength than the town that is attacking, (In this case way less) the defending town could receive some great buffs depending on how much the strength difference is. This way since the town is barely starting and that this huge town wants their territory plus to grind them, while defending they could receive some much needed help. Like a ton more health for their TG, higher damage Golems, more Golems, or even a wither to aid them! This could help balance the fight as it'd feel more fair to the small town but also force huge towns to work harder for that last territory they need to become World Capital.
Three, this one is a bit crazy and probably too ambitious but I'll share it anyway. Maybe make a brand new continent meant for just new towns? This continent, if they choose to, means that they can live there and learn the ropes. Without the pressure of huge towns breathing down their necks. Plus this gives them the opportunity to attack other beginning towns and learn how the conquest fights work along with how to improve. To keep new towns always fresh on this continent you'd have only a month or two to learn on this continent before you need to stake your claim on the main three and choose to make an alliance or not.
These are a couple of ideas I came up with to maybe solve the problem. Yet I don't know how the development process works so this might not be possible. Either way, I hope that these options could get some more brainstorming going in others so we can find a good solution to keep new players and make them feel prepared for the server!
Beetee_Latier
Member
There really isn’t much Loka can do to stop veterans from dominating without creating unfair policies that most likely wouldn’t change much. The best we can really do is as a community look down on people who target new players (which we slightly do now).
I agree on to some extent, but the issue would be making fights TOO even, in that a huge Town can't take over a tiny Town with two people.
Well then we have the problem that the town doesn’t have to supply making god gear obsolete
First of all I don't understand why you may have thought that any town that you are not allied with or have not made an agreement with would want to allow you to 'grow'. Conquest is a competitive game mode no town is deserving of land just because they are new, land has to be earned either by being able to take and hold that land or by making agreements with other towns whether that be the continent cap or banding together with smaller towns. I do agree that that task can be quite daunting and we have made a concerted effort to try to eliminate many of the barriers for new towns to become conquest viable. Such as the Arcanum making for easy enchanting and the resource isles for resource gathering. Next I think that if you are not skilled enough in pvp to fight people for land then don't lots of towns that have little to no pvpers have gained and lost land overtime by participating in Lokas politics making deals and assisting towns in ways other than pvp such as Tera Marie brewing pots for all the alliances they have been in in exchange for the land that the alliance then gives her.
Competitive games will always have pricks and it is naive to think that there is any way short of whole sale separating towns into brackets of how strong they are and only allowing conflict within those brackets. We have made efforts to make content for those not able to fight the Biggest towns on their continent but maybe they can fight other smaller towns from other continents through Rivina.
I agree that the easiest path to endgame is to join a big town and that is a choice that is left to the player. Though I do not agree that this is the only way to enjoy Loka there are many small towns that have existed that have little to middling success in conquest though have had their own fun by participating in Loka politics and their own small wars with other towns, places like Zorros come to mind.
I may agree that those that are attempting to trick you into coming back to fights are not being 'friendly' but it is my opinion that competitive servers will always have a bit of conflict whether it be banter or trash talking the only places that you will get a server that is entirely 'friendly' as i believe you mean it is on a server that has no conflict and that's not the type of server i think any of us want to play on, conflict makes things fun.
tl;dr Land on Loka is earned not given, there are ways to catch up to big towns in meaningful ways and there are more ways to participate in the grand game of conquest than just fighting.
Loka is friendly to new players. Your town started claiming control of multiple biomes on a continent you're not the capital of. Of course you're gonna step on some toes of other, more experienced players. That's just the way of the game. You also really shouldn't even think about claiming land until you can equip you and your town members all with protection 4 armor (your other member that participated in the fight only had the free iron dock armor and didn't even have a sword).
OperaGhost2004
Active Member
personally, I refrain from raiding towns newer than two months old for this very reason, but if you attack larger, more established towns, hard luck buddy. If you start a war that you can't win, you have no grounds for expecting them to stop fighting you.
Beetee_Latier
Member
You place on the beetee you get the eatee
Honestly, I'm surprised nobody has addressed the point of grinding for resources/members is of significant importance.
There's really a third option, you can gain resources and members over time and become capital; all of these capital towns with god tier weapons and armour didn't get them over night, they had to go to RI's and gain members for these things. Using Elysian Pact as an example, they were originally owned by a small RP town, they waged war on arguably the strongest alliance on the server and won from mass recruitment, tactics and grinding for resources.
It's definitely possible to create a town and make the town something capital worthy but it definitely takes effort, it may seem like there are two options but in reality it's a much higher number.
There's really a third option, you can gain resources and members over time and become capital; all of these capital towns with god tier weapons and armour didn't get them over night, they had to go to RI's and gain members for these things. Using Elysian Pact as an example, they were originally owned by a small RP town, they waged war on arguably the strongest alliance on the server and won from mass recruitment, tactics and grinding for resources.
It's definitely possible to create a town and make the town something capital worthy but it definitely takes effort, it may seem like there are two options but in reality it's a much higher number.
yes while i see your point here is mine. we took the mesas for a resource to make ours buildings because no on would sell them to us. your market is broken and hardly used. resource island is hard as heck for new players. the vex are just to much for starting gear. i realize we started the war and that's on us. however we as a new town cant seem to buy the items we are looking for and places like noobville don't want us to be able to gather it either.
we originally wanted to alli with noobville and he replied no you have nothing to offer. so basically at least in this case we cant alli with him for the resource, we cant buy the resource because he isn't gathering and selling it, and we cant own it to go gather it ourselves. by trying to force trade you have crippled the value of new towns. they have nothing to offer for an alliance because they cant take a biome without the big players coming over and saying no that side of the map is ours. and that is understandable its a pvp server.
i'm not saying the issue is the game itself i'm saying its the community. there are lots of nice players and lots of dicks on every server. i understand that. however in this case not an hour or two before the battle the chat was talking about how it was getting boring and that there was no conquest and with everyone going back to school the server was going to be dead for a while. than as soon as conquest was happening they all joined one side. that's a kind of unbalance that needs to be fixed in some way.
and yes while the towns not friendly or allied with us wouldn't want us to grow our allies should. they shouldn't just see the odds and switch sides just to farm of those stats. i pvp in many other games and in my opinion while smashing noobs can be somewhat amusing the first time (the first fight never more) i find the real enjoyment is from fighting the stronger players. yet in loka it doesn't seem like the stronger players want to fight each other. they are more concerned with the numbers on their sword. this is even more evident when you try to Que up for a battle ground.
we originally wanted to alli with noobville and he replied no you have nothing to offer. so basically at least in this case we cant alli with him for the resource, we cant buy the resource because he isn't gathering and selling it, and we cant own it to go gather it ourselves. by trying to force trade you have crippled the value of new towns. they have nothing to offer for an alliance because they cant take a biome without the big players coming over and saying no that side of the map is ours. and that is understandable its a pvp server.
i'm not saying the issue is the game itself i'm saying its the community. there are lots of nice players and lots of dicks on every server. i understand that. however in this case not an hour or two before the battle the chat was talking about how it was getting boring and that there was no conquest and with everyone going back to school the server was going to be dead for a while. than as soon as conquest was happening they all joined one side. that's a kind of unbalance that needs to be fixed in some way.
and yes while the towns not friendly or allied with us wouldn't want us to grow our allies should. they shouldn't just see the odds and switch sides just to farm of those stats. i pvp in many other games and in my opinion while smashing noobs can be somewhat amusing the first time (the first fight never more) i find the real enjoyment is from fighting the stronger players. yet in loka it doesn't seem like the stronger players want to fight each other. they are more concerned with the numbers on their sword. this is even more evident when you try to Que up for a battle ground.
OperaGhost2004
Active Member
this message starts with a disclaimer: I am not trying to paint a bad picture of the Covenant, nor am I implying that Eldritch was a bad and tyrannical capital. that said, when ModernMozart and I started Heldenstadt, we were entirely surrounded by Eldritch territory, we couldn't claim around our town for over 5 months after it was started, and if we tried, Eldritch would rightly defend their territory. we were total noobs, it took me over a month to survive an RI trip. what did we do? we built, we farmed resources even though we had no territory, we mined underneath our town until we could gather ores from the RIs, and overall had a great and fun time.
the town of Heldenstadt is still alive and prospering, and is a level 20 town
the town of Heldenstadt is still alive and prospering, and is a level 20 town
The market is hardly used for blocks like that because they're bought in bulk. TBH most sales in the market are scams and overpriced and you should message people to trade rather than looking for them in the market. The market is in need of an overhaul but trade is still very much a thing that is possible.
And towards how the community is... well that's just the name of the game. I am not nearly skilled enough to be able to classify myself as a PvPer but I still find success because I befriended people and found my own creative way to become rich on the server and make myself useful with my personal resources. You don't need the RI to become rich (though its the quickest way not gonna lie), You don't need to PvP to become successful (though some have different definitions of successful on Loka I suppose).
PvP is necessary if you want to keep your land 75% of the time. But you don't NEED land. Honestly asking for land is part of the politics of Loka. You ask the War Lords who own the continent if you can take certain land to avoid blood shed and backlash. Maybe you have to give them some of your output. If you can't win the war game or the trade game, then you play the politic game. If none works, well, that's when you have some hard decisions to make. However, its all rooted in the politics of the game and that is something I feel many people forget. Politics and friends can carry you to victory alone in Loka, even if you don't have a single god set of gear to your name.
People usually don’t queue unless their friends are also about to drop into the game. A simple “PG anyone?” Usually gets one or 2 people to play it w/ you
After reading all this, I've come to see how versatile Loka's conquest really is. Starting a new town is pretty tough, especially since there are the big dogs out there. But after reading all of this I see that it really takes a creative mind to work your way up which I find really cool. @Aggressive_Gibon had many good points. Don't start fights you can't win in the first place, but instead try to involve yourself and grow in other areas of Loka. You can make alliances, start with the new/small town politics and work your way up. Or try to stay under the radar like Opera and gather your resources to tackle the RI's. Really Loka is a living breathing realistic community. There's a lot of fun to be had, you just gotta be creative about how you do it, and sooner or later you'll find your spot on Loka. ^^