Conquest Ultimatum

[Skuhoo]

While Eldritch would like to gain capital through normal, fair Conquest battles the lack of TGens on the map is preventing us from doing so. From what we’ve gathered through talking to people in public chat and private messages, the motive behind everyone removing their TGens is to not participate in Conquest this month and instead let Capital be unclaimed. Once again, we would like to have a month of Conquest, but whenever we have asked the only responses were insults and telling us that we should attack our only ally, Hilo. Loka currently has more active members than it has for the past few months, but the amount of Conquest fights does not reflect this.

If no other town on the server decides to put down TGens, Hilo and Eldritch will be trading wins to each other instead of doing absolutely nothing. Once again, we do not want to do this, but we likewise don’t want a month to end with no TGen fights save a single battle. Our objective in doing this is not to give each other free points, but to motivate the other towns to participate in Conquest.

The best way to stop an opposing town from obtaining Capital should not be to sit around and do absolutely nothing, but should instead be about defeating your opponent through Conquest.

In summary,

 

[Ajaxan]

I think you are looking at it wrong. For a continent to have a capital that continent needs to be thriving. If you prevent it from thriving by beating the pulp out of any and everyone you shouldn't be rewarded for ruling over a continent in ruin. Either way, I do have some suggestions and criticism of the way y'all are doing things.

1. Its hard for you to claim a system is broken when you sit around and only pick on new people. Go to war with Hilo instead of waiting for a new town to rise up only to be promptly squashed by the combined power of Hilo and Eldritch. I know we joke about y'all attacking each other often but in all seriousness you can't be complaining about a lack of war when you ally yourself with the only town that can offer a fair fight.
2. You need to be helping towns grow. Hilo is much worse than y'all in this department but I've seen neither one of you do anything to help other towns grow. You simple sit around and crush anyone who even begins to expand their borders. If you were instead help towns grow and promise not to hit them more than 1-2 times per month no matter what you might find you have no trouble getting capital because people don't feel like their going to be immediately wiped out.
3. The final point is again something Hilo is worse at than y'all and even Crypt could pitch in here to make this a more clear option. Be a nice capital. Make people like you. If they like you they may be willing to give y'all points to be capital because its better than anyone else having capital and also not having a capital. (Imagine if you could provide capital policies that benefited everyone on the continent). At the very least, don't do the opposite like tax people harder and embargo items.

And as for your ultimatum... I'll be interested to see if it works. I'd be pretty surprised if you could actually both obtain capital that way. Seems pretty hard to do given that if you get X amount of points from a battle, the other side loses X amount of points.

And as a final point, if you just want to fight and aren't as concerned about capital, don't attack people. Promise them you'll only defend yourself. Now towns can feel safe making tgens and not feel like its a useless endeavor. And with tgens they can now place inhibs and attack y'all.

TL;DR: Ruling with an iron fist is only a good idea if you don't want competition.

 

[Grubul]

I would vote for Conquest win trading to be banned. Same as arena win trading is banned.

 

[Grubul]

And motivating other towns to participate. Well, then why did Hilo completley cover the whole area around auru, so it couldnt place a single tgen anymore?

 

[nokiaman]

We had war for like 3 bloody months, you had plenty of war and plenty of Capital, We decided to spend our Shards and Resources on other towns who needs them more.

 

[TempestBlood]

I took my licks trying to even get into PvP, in which you not-so-politely informed me to deal with it. I'll pass on trying until I feel like I'm good and ready.

Oh, and then you made fun of my statements in Public chat about my visions being "myoptic." Not YOU, per se, but your town, of which you are the primary representative.

So, have fun playing with yourselves. We're taking our ball and going home for now.

 

[TempestBlood]

In addendum, you've stated yourself that the advantage of Capital is not really a big deal. So why make a big deal about there being NO capital?

"The best way to stop an opposing town from obtaining Capital should not be to sit around and do absolutely nothing, but should instead be about defeating your opponent through Conquest."

Allow me to retort. The best way to encourage towns to join PvP isn't to taunt them and demoralize them at every given opportunity in public. You prattling on in chat about your 11v17 victory against a bunch of new people, then when Auru explained that they didn't have their gear fully up, you goaded them with the prospect (this you've used against Sudkuste as well) that "Maybe they shouldn't be in a war they know nothing about."

Well, good. There's no war. Now they can learn.

 

[bat3415]

I would vote for Conquest win trading to be banned. Same as arena win trading is banned.

If you were to ban win trading, and the only way for Loka to possibly have a capital at the moment is for Hilo and Eldritch to legitimately go to war with one another, which neither of us is willing to do, the fact that all enemies have chosen to go into hiding for a month because they say they're "not ready" to participate in conquest, is not a reason for there to be no capital, in fact, if you had chosen to keep the fight simply between Hilo and Auru as we had asked, without bringing allies (either by choice or by them just going, I don't know which it was) you likely would have won the first fight, with the large numbers of Auru, and with our terrible pvpers in Hilo, the best of which is probably Mattattack1000, who hasn't been on the server in quite a while, and as far as I know, not even on minecraft.

 

[Grubul]

if there is no capital then let it be. Thats your own fault that you have destroyed every single resistance to your alliance. And made it so auru couldnt resist anymore.



play fair.

 

[Grubul]

not my problem you and eldritch allied up.

 

[Skuhoo]

I think you are looking at it wrong. For a continent to have a capital that continent needs to be thriving. If you prevent it from thriving by beating the pulp out of any and everyone you shouldn't be rewarded for ruling over a continent in ruin. Either way, I do have some suggestions and criticism of the way y'all are doing things.

1. Its hard for you to claim a system is broken when you sit around and only pick on new people. Go to war with Hilo instead of waiting for a new town to rise up only to be promptly squashed by the combined power of Hilo and Eldritch. I know we joke about y'all attacking each other often but in all seriousness you can't be complaining about a lack of war when you ally yourself with the only town that can offer a fair fight.
2. You need to be helping towns grow. Hilo is much worse than y'all in this department but I've seen neither one of you do anything to help other towns grow. You simple sit around and crush anyone who even begins to expand their borders. If you were instead help towns grow and promise not to hit them more than 1-2 times per month no matter what you might find you have no trouble getting capital because people don't feel like their going to be immediately wiped out.
3. The final point is again something Hilo is worse at than y'all and even Crypt could pitch in here to make this a more clear option. Be a nice capital. Make people like you. If they like you they may be willing to give y'all points to be capital because its better than anyone else having capital and also not having a capital. (Imagine if you could provide capital policies that benefited everyone on the continent). At the very least, don't do the opposite like tax people harder and embargo items.

And as for your ultimatum... I'll be interested to see if it works. I'd be pretty surprised if you could actually both obtain capital that way. Seems pretty hard to do given that if you get X amount of points from a battle, the other side loses X amount of points.

And as a final point, if you just want to fight and aren't as concerned about capital, don't attack people. Promise them you'll only defend yourself. Now towns can feel safe making tgens and not feel like its a useless endeavor. And with tgens they can now place inhibs and attack y'all.

TL;DR: Ruling with an iron fist is only a good idea if you don't want competition.

1. Like we've said before, we would have a mock war with Hilo if there wasn't a possibility that the others town could place TGens and a have a huge advantage over us.

2. I'm not sure what you expect me to do exactly. It's not like I haven't helped new towns before, but when everyone on the playerlist is red then it's a bit difficult to do that.

3. Besides the one time we embargoed birch because we were curious how it worked, we have never picked a negative policy. This month we have an unused policy choice that remains unused because we don't want to pick a negative policy. Eldritch is a nice capital.

 

[Skuhoo]

And motivating other towns to participate. Well, then why did Hilo completley cover the whole area around auru, so it couldnt place a single tgen anymore?

I didn't know that there wasn't any area that you could place a TGen. I'll ask that Hilo removes a few to keep it fair.

 

[Opyc]

if there is no capital then let it be. Thats your own fault that you have destroyed every single resistance to your alliance. And made it so auru couldnt resist anymore.



play fair.

You say play fair which i did play fair i told skuhoo and his buddies to only show if your buddies showed up. All fair in love and war. If want a fair fight don't bring friends and i won't bring mine.

not my problem you and eldritch allied up.

This was done when everone was targeting us in the past which you all are doing the same thing with 7 towns. Same shit different pile.

"The best way to stop an opposing town from obtaining Capital should not be to sit around and do absolutely nothing, but should instead be about defeating your opponent through Conquest."

That is the problem with conquest right now is that you need conquest to get to that point. If the 900 strength cap is removed like how it was originally intended it would fix this issue.



And tbh spruce will be embargoed until you resist btw.

 

[TempestBlood]

No one buys your martyr complex, Mopyc. And it's not the fact that you guys (again, mostly Eldritch) kick everyone's butt. It's how awful you are to the people you're fighting in chat. Your steadfast refusal to acknowledge your wrongdoings, and your whininess and (regarding this "Ultimatum") straight up hypocrisy when you don't get your way. You and your members (not all, but again, your flag, your town, your representatives) are insulting, unfriendly, and downright douchy with the way that they treat some of the community.

It's not that we don't want to PVP. It's that we don't want to PVP. With. You.

 

[Cryptite]

This is obviously a flaw of the current Conquest system and is a big part of why C2 will be different in terms of there being objectives for participants in the system even when there aren't any other towns playing.

 

[Magpieman]

I will not stop any win trading, all that can be gained from it is the first 10 wins bonus. I also have little sympathy for those who take down their T Gens just to prevent others gaining points. In my view that is just as bad if not worse. They both act as a way of abusing the system which I hope we can solve come conquest 2.0. Equally I think both Eldritch and Hilo should tone down the taunting in chat. But at the end of the day it's a game with a fair amount of strategic depth and both parties are going about it a different way. As Cryptite said it is the systems fault not any players, since it relies on people placing T gens. But all this should be resolved once conquest 2.0 hits.

 

[kallious]

Where is everyone getting this idea that Eldritch and Hilo are attacking every new town that pops up for points? Earlier this month Auru, Varmastrand, New Ibbish, and Fang Creek all had TGens up for a pretty significant amount of time. During this time Hilo attacked Auru once, and their intent was to not involve us at Eldritch, and to just have a battle with Hilo vs Auru for old times sake. So where are you getting this false idea that we're attacking everyone? I could understand if we were destroying literally every tgen that has been placed, but Eldritch hasn't placed a single inhib this month, despite the weeks where multiple targets were available to us.

How on earth have we destroyed every bit of resistance by not fighting anyone? Seven towns decided to ally together to make a super alliance consisting of a huge amount of the active members on this server, and you all stop fighting after one battle saying that you've been crushed?

 

[Cryptite]

Where is everyone getting this idea that Eldritch and Hilo are attacking every new town that pops up for points? Earlier this month Auru, Varmastrand, New Ibbish, and Fang Creek all had TGens up for a pretty significant amount of time. During this time Hilo attacked Auru once, and their intent was to not involve us at Eldritch, and to just have a battle with Hilo vs Auru for old times sake. So where are you getting this false idea that we're attacking everyone? I could understand if we were destroying literally every tgen that has been placed, but Eldritch hasn't placed a single inhib this month, despite the weeks where multiple targets were available to us.

How on earth have we destroyed every bit of resistance by not fighting anyone? Seven towns decided to ally together to make a super alliance consisting of a huge amount of the active members on this server, and you all stop fighting after one battle saying that you've been crushed?

Maybe they're just talking about the fact that bat raids every new town.

 

[Jedoi]

And tbh spruce will be embargoed until you resist btw.

I care very little for or about Conquest. For the most part I tolerate it, but the moment it starts interfering with non-PvP aspects of the server (building, RP) I get upset. People who want no part in your war are negatively affected. That was nothing more than a jerk move, and now you're punishing us for not wanting to play your game.

 

[Calixx_]

I think you are looking at it wrong. For a continent to have a capital that continent needs to be thriving. If you prevent it from thriving by beating the pulp out of any and everyone you shouldn't be rewarded for ruling over a continent in ruin. Either way, I do have some suggestions and criticism of the way y'all are doing things.

1. Its hard for you to claim a system is broken when you sit around and only pick on new people. Go to war with Hilo instead of waiting for a new town to rise up only to be promptly squashed by the combined power of Hilo and Eldritch. I know we joke about y'all attacking each other often but in all seriousness you can't be complaining about a lack of war when you ally yourself with the only town that can offer a fair fight.
2. You need to be helping towns grow. Hilo is much worse than y'all in this department but I've seen neither one of you do anything to help other towns grow. You simple sit around and crush anyone who even begins to expand their borders. If you were instead help towns grow and promise not to hit them more than 1-2 times per month no matter what you might find you have no trouble getting capital because people don't feel like their going to be immediately wiped out.
3. The final point is again something Hilo is worse at than y'all and even Crypt could pitch in here to make this a more clear option. Be a nice capital. Make people like you. If they like you they may be willing to give y'all points to be capital because its better than anyone else having capital and also not having a capital. (Imagine if you could provide capital policies that benefited everyone on the continent). At the very least, don't do the opposite like tax people harder and embargo items.

And as for your ultimatum... I'll be interested to see if it works. I'd be pretty surprised if you could actually both obtain capital that way. Seems pretty hard to do given that if you get X amount of points from a battle, the other side loses X amount of points.

And as a final point, if you just want to fight and aren't as concerned about capital, don't attack people. Promise them you'll only defend yourself. Now towns can feel safe making tgens and not feel like its a useless endeavor. And with tgens they can now place inhibs and attack y'all.

TL;DR: Ruling with an iron fist is only a good idea if you don't want competition.

if there is no capital then let it be. Thats your own fault that you have destroyed every single resistance to your alliance. And made it so auru couldnt resist anymore.



play fair.

The issue is that the only way to capital is through conquest, and we still want to participate even though none of you do. Just because everyone except for our one ally don't want to compete should not preclude us from achieving capital if we have the means and motivation to do so. It's not our fault that our enemies told all the new players on the server that we were some big, bad tyrants, and that they should join the fight against us. We did not provoke fights with anyone. While our war with NI went back and forth for a while, ultimately that conflict was started by them, not us. For example, we only attacked Sudkuste because they were allied with NI, and they were closer to us, and more convenient. Skuhoo and I, along with the rest of Eldritch, have/had no intention of making enemies with every player on the server. We avoid implementing policies that would have negative effects on other towns, and would have been (and still are) glad to try and help new towns get into conquest, because ultimately, we don't want to have completely uncontested control over the continent, because that's not fun for us either. The fact of the matter is. our enemies jumped at the opportunity to turn all the new players on the server against us, and then decided that they didn't want to fight since we were still winning.

I do understand that some of you want nothing to do with conquest, and that's okay. And I also realize that some want to take some time to gather resources, practice pvping, and try to learn conquest better, which is great (I look forward to people coming back for bigger and better battles in Conquest 2.0). But it still remains that we shouldn't be punished for wanting to be capital when no one else does. And while we could mock war with Hilo, a lot of our members are occupied with things IRL, and we don't really have the numbers to make it fun. In addition, we've been on the server for nearly 8 months now, and Hilo is the only town to have ever helped us. Back when Eldritch was a tiny little babby town, The Isle, Ignis, and Woodswork all attacked us, and Hilo was the one town that stepped up and offered us help against them. And we know how you feel about seemingly unbeatable enemies. Pre-1.9, Elysium was basically untouchable, but those who opposed them worked hard, banded together, and fought the good fight, no matter if we won or lost, and we all had fun, because everyone gave it their all. So I understand that you all want to try and improve before throwing more resources into conquest. But you have no right to complain when you form a 3-continent alliance of effectively every town on the server, and all decide to stop pvping, because that denies us any legitimate path to capital, forcing us to win trade, which we really don't want to do unless there's no other option.

P.S. While I do disagree with what Hilo (allegedly) did with the TGens surrounding Auru, other than that we have not done anything but play fair. We didn't pick fights with the new towns, they were brought into it by our enemies. Beating you legitimately in conquest is not unfair.