Steve5729 betraying Djscales101 and stealing his items.

[NerdieBirdieYT]

Wow okay this a lot.

As has been stated, the character of either player involved is totally irrelevant in terms of rules, so I’ll refrain from commenting on either individual.

I’d like to hear from @Steve5729 on this to get all the details as well as Dj but assuming this happened exactly as stated, yeah, that’s a really scummy thing to do, and yeah, it is within the rules. I totally agree with Mag that it would be extremely hard to put rules in place where Owners don’t own every item within the Town, and I also agree that this concept...

I could literally invite you to my town, kill you, take your stuff, and then do this to more and more people until they quit, even if I was a slicer.

... is indeed possible with the current rules, and that just doesn’t seem right to me. How to fix it, I don’t know.

I disagree Steve should be punished by admins, even if rules are changed. Retroactive rules are a no-no. That being said, if all this is true, I am personally super disappointed with Steve, and agree the community should take the rebuttal into their own hands, regardless of any rules modified because of this.

 

[Skuhoo]

Yeah but with that logic, I could literally invite you to my town, kill you, take your stuff, and then do this to more and more people until they quit, even if I was a slicer. Surely this requires a rule change, and in the instance that the rules are altered, Steve should be punished and be the first example of these rules being implemented as he knew it was borderline anyway

You're right, you absolutely can do that and it's been done before. It's not as if we condone the behavior, but it is impossible to write an enforceable rule that would cover these situations. That is why we rely on the community to "punish" players who do stuff like this. Warning new players, embargoes, raids, etc are all options the community have available to them if they choose to do something about it.

Steve's actions were not "borderline against the rules". Our language in the Town Owners section of the rules makes it very clear that he was playing within the rules.

 

[SigmaFlash]

Yeah but with that logic, I could literally invite you to my town, kill you, take your stuff, and then do this to more and more people until they quit, even if I was a slicer. Surely this requires a rule change, and in the instance that the rules are altered, Steve should be punished and be the first example of these rules being implemented as he knew it was borderline anyway

I totally agree. Owners have too much power and the members can't even live in a town without knowing that they will get betrayed or not.

 

[Steve5729]

Right I didn't want to reply but I guess I have to so here it goes:
Yes, I did kick DJ from my town, after he announced that he would be going to join Caelos, I confirmed that he joined then transferred all his shards either into ancient ingots or into my town balance. When DJ was either removed or kicked from their town he asked me for his stuff back which I told him I had already spent. I then asked an admin if it was possible for the items to be rolled back so I could return them to DJ which the answer was no. I then offered DJ to give him back all unspent items as well as some diamond blocks and he denied it. There is one more thing I'd like to address but since I have gone through DJ's house and other storages there was only somewhere near about a single chest of filled shulkers, not the claimed double chest. I am not opposed to still giving back all unspent items to DJ, however, the shards are out of my reach and I don't feel like giving him 15k shards when he denied my other offer to give him some.

By the way I'm not going to be posting again because this thread shouldn't have been made and should have just been a report on discord to crypt or mag.

 

[catfishjw]

I totally agree. Owners have too much power and the members can't even live in a town without knowing that they will get betrayed or not.

I mean that’s kind of the point of someone leading the town, with great power comes great responsibility

 

[Sparky___]

I understand your frustration but we've been unable to find a good solution to this problem in the years it's been an issue. If anyone has a real, enforceable solution we're all ears but we won't punish a player for playing within the rules even if I, from a player's perspective, do disagree with their actions.

I want to push what Sku said here as I think it's really important for everyone to consider if you are frustrated, disgusted, etc about this. If you think there should be a change with regard to this rule, then I think everyone would benefit from talking about suggestions for a real and enforceable solution.

 

[SigmaFlash]

#JusticeForDJ

 

[Smp]

i just want to point out the fact that all y'all are taking the side of steve yet he did basicly the same thing nova is/was known for on loka for town stealing from his own members, sure nova did it more but literaly anyone who knew nova outside of mira hated him for tstealing yet you like steve even tho he stole items????

 

[Djscales101]

I did say I would be joining caelos for a week then coming back not even a few minutes later he kicked me not even letting me get anything. The reason i told him I didn’t want his diamond blocks was because I didn’t want him to think giving me 2.6k would make up for 15k shards. After all I thought I could trust him after everything I had helped him with and I even told him I wouldn’t stay long which I ended up staying longer than I thought. And the fact that he wouldn’t get any reproductions just because he owns a town is king of ubserd, it’s saying if I was to leave a town and take my own things an owner could accuse me of town betray because it was in their town. This all also happend right after a conquest fight so I didn’t have time to do anything.-Djscales101

 

[koi0001]

i just want to point out the fact that all y'all are taking the side of steve yet he did basicly the same thing nova is/was known for on loka for town stealing from his own members, sure nova did it more but literaly anyone who knew nova outside of mira hated him for tstealing yet you like steve even tho he stole items????

Nobody is taking Steve's side they are simply pointing out that the rules are structured this way and there's not really a reasonable way to restructure them. Nobody likes the idea of town owners stealing from their members but it certainly isn't against server rules.

 

[Grubul]

Well i am taking Steve's side. He is a good man, and he has followed all the rules. Shame him all you want, but he has done nothing wrong within the rules. Ethically, maybe you could've talked it out more and reason why you are leaving.

If someone be in my town, and would state that you are joining the enemy, id kick the person out in an instant as well.
He did try to give you your stuff back, even if in different state of item, but you refused, so why complain?
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Seems like most of you dont even care about the rules, and want to get steve in trouble. Once a rule changes, you cant punish for something done before.
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And DjScales, i can provide you dubs and dubs of enchanted books if you want.

 

[NerdieBirdieYT]

I did say I would be joining caelos for a week then coming back not even a few minutes later he kicked me not even letting me get anything. The reason i told him I didn’t want his diamond blocks was because I didn’t want him to think giving me 2.6k would make up for 15k shards. After all I thought I could trust him after everything I had helped him with and I even told him I wouldn’t stay long which I ended up staying longer than I thought. And the fact that he wouldn’t get any reproductions just because he owns a town is king of ubserd, it’s saying if I was to leave a town and take my own things an owner could accuse me of town betray because it was in their town. This all also happend right after a conquest fight so I didn’t have time to do anything.-Djscales101

Let me get this straight...

You had all these items and shards clearly marked as your own. You told Steve you’d be leaving the Town. Steve immediately kicked you from the Town, took all your items, killed you, and offered you about 2k shards in compensation.

Is that correct?

 

[Djscales101]

He didn’t kill me but everything else is true

 

[NerdieBirdieYT]

He didn’t kill me but everything else is true

Alright, lovely.

By the way I'm not going to be posting again because this thread shouldn't have been made and should have just been a report on discord to crypt or mag.

Most of us aren’t trying to say you broke any rules, so a report wouldn’t really be viable. I think it’s more of a discussion on what exactly happened, and whether this type of thing should be allowed to happen.

Edit:
Didn’t notice this was in Complaints... this would definitely be better off in a different section. As Mag said, no rules have been broken.

 

[Wemb]

Steve is really meant to be a respectable player so I feel as if it's unfair to really take sides before he makes a post defending himself.

EDIT: @Steve5729

Very respectable player

 

[DeceitfulPear]

What Steve did is within his right as a town owner until we find a way to create a rule that prevents this type of action. Considering ethically I don't know a single player that thinks a town owner being able to do this is ok.

Despite how simple it sounds, it is actually insanely difficult and causes too many gray areas to split item ownership to anyone but the town owner due to the rule against town-betrayal. We believe it is a necessary evil but honestly we would love finding a rule that protects all players' items while also not making the topic of town betrayal an insanely complicated headache or even flat out impossible to prove. Cases of players stealing and leaving are by far more common than a town owner stealing all someone owns and kicking them.

I do hope to steer this thread into a way of coming up with some rule that we can protect the rights of all players' items and not have it devolve into a thread of just bashing someone's behavior.

 

[Grubul]

Or simply dont join towns that are known with owners kicking and keeping the members stuff.

 

[Djscales101]

How would that help new players then

 

[DeceitfulPear]

How would that help new players then

And I was gonna write another long post but that states everything in a way better fashion

 

[Grubul]

but new players dont have anything bad towns could steal